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t5000
t5000
Tscc Ep 01 Pilot my thoughts after 3 years [2008-2011]
Jul 8 2011, 5:13 AM EDT | Post edited: Jul 8 2011, 5:13 AM EDT
ok I just watched the pilot again, will watch ep 2 next.
alot of time has passed so now I see some things differently. the pilot is still flawed, but not so bad as I once thought it was.
I can still see where and why it lost alot of the nielsen viewers. but I enjoyed it more after all this time.
here is some stuff I wrote after seeing it. it is muddled, but I will post it as is.
--------------
the Pilot 1x01
cam says to john- in the future you have many friends, later in series it is made to seem he is a loner with no friends.
the explosives for the truck she used as a bomb at dyson house, where did she get them and it seems that she put them in after she pulled off the bumper to the truck, which means they were driving a bomb to the dyson house.
when they were headed to mexico cam was ok with that, and seemingly had no intention of going to the bank. but then sarah tells john she will stop JD [cause he is whining] and then they go to dysons house, for info,which they get nothing,, then cameron decides to go to the bank, and for some reason thinks 2007 is the year to go to. so maybe she just thought they needed to jump time to lose cromartie.
but here is the flaw, if cromartie had not come thru with them, he would have hidden again and just waited for something to turn up which in 2007, and it would have with sarah being video'd naked which cromartie would have picked up on.
so a better story would have been if the gun had just burned off cromartie's flesh , and he then became garret,and then waited for them to show up. that way no head traveling thru time, with no flesh, and no head on a dead body, no t body out in dump.
about dates, april 19 2011 was J. day, cam was from 2027, and they jumped to 9-3-07
so I figure this show was supposed to air in sept 07, not jan 08.
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Keyword tags: 2007 2011 Ep 01 Pilot Tscc
t5000
t5000
1. RE: Tscc Ep 01 Pilot my thoughts after 3 years [2008-2011]
Jul 8 2011, 5:16 AM EDT | Post edited: Jul 8 2011, 5:16 AM EDT
continued part 2
sarah made alot of mistakes in this ep,
1. did not change her last name, or alias...... and of course the same first names!
2.going to dysons house allowed cromartie to pick them up there , it was the only place he would know of that she would go? and she gets shot there , but she is ok the next morning, and after another few hours she is back to normal.[ she heals as fast as a T!]
3.she hesitates for long time on the time jump , which allows cromartie time to break in thru the door, then she shoots his head off, which comes into time bubble.
4. she comes back to the school after hearing of the shootings and is using binoculars, looking around?? which seemed weird to me, I would think sarah would just walk right up looking for john. but no she has her field glasses and is surveying the scene, and then boom! somehow cromartie sneaks right up on her and grabs her. so not smart to go to school john has either fled or is dead.[ this is only time I think, ever, that a Term has "snuck up" on someone:) ]
and I have to admit the john shown in this first show is like he was babied by sarah his whole life, and not trained at all except how to run and hide, and be a loner.
worst lines, really cheesy stuff by JF
1. I know the rules like they are written on the inside of my eyeballs .
2. class dismissed
3.better put those back in their holster.
[ and also the things cam asked john were kind of lame? what does your dad do , then same thing with mom.... should have been_ hey wanna do something "tight" tonight?
good lines
1. thank you for explaining [forgot this came in ep 01]
2. dont you know ? ...it's the robots![by ellison]
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t5000
t5000
2. RE: Tscc Ep 01 Pilot my thoughts after 3 years [2008-2011]
Jul 8 2011, 5:20 AM EDT | Post edited: Jul 8 2011, 5:20 AM EDT
cont. part 3
The intro dream scene lena looked awful in that, and it should have been cut out, and just start with the show, add 5 min of something else. In the 1st scene after with charlie, she looks so much better and her hair is longer, so good amount of time passed by for the making of this pilot, so there was plenty of time to do it better than what we see as the final version.
so on looking at this again 3 years after I first saw it, it does not seem as bad, to me anyway as I know what comes later. but when I first saw it there wasnt much to like except cameron
and here is something funny, what if john had not gone to school that day? would cromartie have still cut his leg open in the first class, and would he have taught classes?
that whole scene was bad, it could have been done better, like have him call role and then when john answers roll call he could then cut his leg and get the gun, and then madly shoot at john and miss over and over.
so hindsight is 20/20, but what I would do is cut off the intro, and add the time elsewhere. cut out the cheesy lines,and change the ending. I would have had her destroy the cromartie term, and then garret could come in as a new T in ep 2, he could be the T in 2007,
just looking for anything, or have had another mission which then he comes across john etc so he changes his mission.
also change the school scene in which cromartie trys to kill john, and not have them go to the dyson house at all....... and I would have had cam eat a whole hamburger , chocolate shake, and fries, instead of just the one chip.
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I.Join
I.Join
3. RE: Tscc Ep 01 Pilot my thoughts after 3 years [2008-2011]
Jul 8 2011, 2:42 PM EDT | Post edited: Jul 8 2011, 2:42 PM EDT
"ok I just watched the pilot again, will watch ep 2 next.
alot of time has passed so now I see some things differently. the pilot is still flawed, but not so bad as I once thought it was.
I can still see where and why it lost alot of the nielsen viewers. but I enjoyed it more after all this time.
here is some stuff I wrote after seeing it. it is muddled, but I will post it as is.
--------------
the Pilot 1x01
1. cam says to john- in the future you have many friends, later in series it is made to seem he is a loner with no friends.
the explosives for the truck she used as a bomb at dyson house, where did she get them and it seems that she put them in after she pulled off the bumper to the truck, which means they were driving a bomb to the dyson house.
2. when they were headed to mexico cam was ok with that, and seemingly had no intention of going to the bank. but then sarah tells john she will stop JD [cause he is whining] and then they go to dysons house, for info,which they get nothing,, then cameron decides to go to the bank, and for some reason thinks 2007 is the year to go to. so maybe she just thought they needed to jump time to lose cromartie.
but here is the flaw, if cromartie had not come thru with them, he would have hidden again and just waited for something to turn up which in 2007, and it would have with sarah being video'd naked which cromartie would have picked up on.
3. so a better story would have been if the gun had just burned off cromartie's flesh , and he then became garret,and then waited for them to show up. that way no head traveling thru time, with no flesh, and no head on a dead body, no t body out in dump.

about dates, april 19 2011 was J. day, cam was from 2027, and they jumped to 9-3-07
so I figure this show was supposed to air in sept 07, not jan 08."
1. I always considered this as her first real lie to John: this shows creativity, since she knew that lie had been positive to him. This was to show us that she somehow knows how an human think and what he can like or dislike.
2. Cameron initial idea (call it "mission", if you believe it was) was to keep John alive (and NOT to prevent JD/stop Skynet). They went to Dyson, I think she expected to know something she didn't know. Having nothing, and wanting to stop JD, she used her only data, but the only she knew was about 2007, so the jump.
About Cromartie, if he hadn't arrived in the bank, he had considered them dead too (as the police did)
3. I like this version
4. WGA strike problems, you know... good point!
Anyway, it was April 21 (Thursday)... so I suppose the show had to last 4 seasons... (it was originally aired in Thursdays, and the end of April is about the end of a season)
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4. RE: Tscc Ep 01 Pilot my thoughts after 3 years [2008-2011]
Jul 8 2011, 2:59 PM EDT | Post edited: Jul 8 2011, 2:59 PM EDT
"continued part 2
sarah made alot of mistakes in this ep,
1. did not change her last name, or alias...... and of course the same first names!
2.going to dysons house allowed cromartie to pick them up there , it was the only place he would know of that she would go? and she gets shot there , but she is ok the next morning, and after another few hours she is back to normal.[ she heals as fast as a T!]
3.she hesitates for long time on the time jump , which allows cromartie time to break in thru the door, then she shoots his head off, which comes into time bubble.
4. she comes back to the school after hearing of the shootings and is using binoculars, looking around?? which seemed weird to me, I would think sarah would just walk right up looking for john. but no she has her field glasses and is surveying the scene, and then boom! somehow cromartie sneaks right up on her and grabs her. so not smart to go to school john has either fled or is dead.[ this is only time I think, ever, that a Term has "snuck up" on someone:) ]
and I have to admit the john shown in this first show is like he was babied by sarah his whole life, and not trained at all except how to run and hide, and be a loner.
worst lines, really cheesy stuff by JF
1. I know the rules like they are written on the inside of my eyeballs .
2. class dismissed
3.better put those back in their holster.
[ and also the things cam asked john were kind of lame? what does your dad do , then same thing with mom.... should have been_ hey wanna do something "tight" tonight?
good lines
1. thank you for explaining [forgot this came in ep 01]
2. dont you know ? ...it's the robots![by ellison]"
1. They kept their first names again after that... very bad idea (you search a school DB for someone called John with a mother called Sarah and you find them...).
2. In Brothers of Nabulus Cameron says Sarah is the best fighter ever... Tell me, why do you think she believes this? Sarah IS a machine! LOL
3. She knew that he had identified the TDE (she didn't know about the self destruction, that, anyway, hadn't destroyed him), so she wanted to destroy him with the plasma rifle. This appears to be a good idea, don't you think?
4. She had nothing to do in the school: if John was death it was too late, otherwise he was somehow safe. But she expected police to be there, so she was far.
The problem was the binocular: if you use it in the sun without some pipes at the end, you can be seen at high distance (remember Leon?)... she had to use empty toilet paper rolls as pipes to block the reflection of the sun on the lens...

Remember that they thought to have avoided JD: they were hiding by police, not by machines. Also remember what John said Cameron in the school about Sarah being apprehensive about him.

2. Horrible! Why waste time doing that?!?! All the leg's part is horrible, but that's what began to let Ellison believe...
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Schmacky
Schmacky
5. RE: Tscc Ep 01 Pilot my thoughts after 3 years [2008-2011]
Jul 8 2011, 3:13 PM EDT | Post edited: Jul 8 2011, 3:16 PM EDT
I wouldn't have wanted Garret to be Cromarte in ep2.

I didn't like that a dead head came through.. some burning flesh as it came through would have been cool and from my understanding, that was the original idea but because it's network TV I guess it would have been too graphic.

Anyway, I like the whole "Cromartie finds skin" plotline. It was pretty cool and original IMO. So, I wouldn't want that changed.

The name situation.. if this was a movie or characters where their names aren't so damn culturally iconic, they probably would have changed their names. But it could be confusing to start them off with X name and then change to Y and etc. I think for ease of production and not in-story reasons, they kept the names John and Sarah.

Sarah keeping the last name Reese was obviously a mistake and meant to be one.. it was a plot driven mistake. Sarah HAD to have kept the last name Reese so that the police and more importantly, Cromartie (and Cameron) could find them. If she changed their last name then no one would have found them.

Sarah hesitating about the time jump and using the plasma rifle.. I'm not sure why you brought this up? You thought it was bad or a mistake? I thought it was as realistic as one can get with this kind of show. Here's a woman with about 10 second notice to jump 8 years into the future and to shoot a Terminator with a weapon that is "not really" (but sorta) nuclear. If there was no hesitation I think that would have been weird.

John being whiney and not what you would expect of John Connor is perfect. The last 5 years of his life has been "normal" (by normal I mean not training for a war of the future). 3 years in foster homes and 2 years with his mother. He hadn't been training or preparing, he was just a seriously messed up kid with a jacked up home life.
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Schmacky
Schmacky
6. RE: Tscc Ep 01 Pilot my thoughts after 3 years [2008-2011]
Jul 8 2011, 3:15 PM EDT | Post edited: Jul 8 2011, 3:15 PM EDT
Oh and most importantly… I liked the opening sequence. I think the voice over and the dream itself was a great tie-in with T2 and exposition for those that are not familiar with the Terminator universe. It gives action right away and the fearsomeness of Terminators without having the characters actually deal with them just yet. Do you find this valuable?    
I.Join
I.Join
7. RE: Tscc Ep 01 Pilot my thoughts after 3 years [2008-2011]
Jul 8 2011, 3:20 PM EDT | Post edited: Jul 8 2011, 3:20 PM EDT
"cont. part 3
1. The intro dream scene lena looked awful in that, and it should have been cut out
2, and just start with the show, add 5 min of something else.

3. In the 1st scene after with charlie, she looks so much better and her hair is longer, so good amount of time passed by for the making of this pilot, so there was plenty of time to do it better than what we see as the final version.
4. so on looking at this again 3 years after I first saw it, it does not seem as bad, to me anyway as I know what comes later. but when I first saw it there wasnt much to like except cameron
5. and here is something funny, what if john had not gone to school that day? would cromartie have still cut his leg open in the first class, and would he have taught classes?
6. that whole scene was bad, it could have been done better, like have him call role and then when john answers roll call he could then cut his leg and get the gun, and then madly shoot at john and miss over and over.
7. so hindsight is 20/20, but what I would do is cut off the intro, and add the time elsewhere. cut out the cheesy lines,and change the ending. I would have had her destroy the cromartie term, and then garret could come in as a new T in ep 2, he could be the T in 2007,
8. just looking for anything, or have had another mission which then he comes across john etc so he changes his mission.
also change the school scene in which cromartie trys to kill john, and not have them go to the dyson house at all.......
9. and I would have had cam eat a whole hamburger , chocolate shake, and fries, instead of just the one chip."
1. Remember: pilots are not for viewers. I know they had spared many $ without that scene, but that wasn't for us. The bad thing is that, having a pilot that is different by the continuation of the show, they lost a good percentage of viewers. More, many of the ones who liked it, surely disliked the show.
2. Like the deleted scene with John and Cameron at the computers, for example...
3. Or she decided to cut her air after the scene with Charley: you need months for airs to become longer, but minutes to cut them. This suggests me that the dream scene could have been added to have a more impressive pilot. Thank you for writing this!
I watched the show as a marathon, and I say it became important only after BtR, when I began to think about it, to ask myself questions and to focus on the main parts of the plot more than on other details. I figure you're doing the same, that's why now you liked it more than the first time: your brain is automatically excluding some details and concentrating to some others... I was going to say that's like the weight each neuron learns to assign to each input in a neural network... but your brain is a (biological) neural network :p
5. He had gone to the bathroom pretending to have been wounded bu something on the desk.
6. It had been longer: be happy it wasn't!
7. I think the writers supposed Cromartie to be destroyed after the pilot, then they re-used him, when they found the way to replace the actor. The part about the blood, the lab and the eyes was good!
8. Remember, after the jump, Skynet didn't longer know where they were.
9. That was too much and too complex for her digestive system: I've always thought they need to eat and drink, cause that's "living tissue", as Kyle said in T1... but not so complexes things (maybe water and sugar and vitamin supplement on early models?). More, the chip is a quote from T2 (John did the same with his mother, who didn't reply).
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8. RE: Tscc Ep 01 Pilot my thoughts after 3 years [2008-2011]
Jul 8 2011, 9:22 PM EDT | Post edited: Jul 8 2011, 9:22 PM EDT
"1. I didn't like that a dead head came through.. some burning flesh as it came through would have been cool and from my understanding, that was the original idea but because it's network TV I guess it would have been too graphic.

2. The name situation.. if this was a movie or characters where their names aren't so damn culturally iconic, they probably would have changed their names. But it could be confusing to start them off with X name and then change to Y and etc. I think for ease of production and not in-story reasons, they kept the names John and Sarah.

3. Sarah keeping the last name Reese was obviously a mistake and meant to be one.. it was a plot driven mistake. Sarah HAD to have kept the last name Reese so that the police and more importantly, Cromartie (and Cameron) could find them. If she changed their last name then no one would have found them.
"
1. Yes, the reason the head came through had to be the one you wrote, and I agree it's stupid. Since I found that explaining after having my one, try to ignore it and read that scene in this other way: the head came through because, as Cameron wanted them (...us) to notice, the chip was active. This better explains why the T-1000 in T2 can go through, why Weaver can go through AND why Cameron's body doesn't came through in BtR. In this way all make more sense (except one thing: why do the LMTs arrive naked, if their "clothes" are part of them?)

2. Well, obviously Sarah had always called her son John, but in public (school) they could have used different names. To be iconic is the pair name + surname, so the icon is altered anyway. (Good the idea to use the surname Baum)

3. I agree: the problem was Sarah HAVING that surname (when with Charley), since she had to want to keep secret John's father identity.

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SupremeDalek
SupremeDalek
9. RE: Tscc Ep 01 Pilot my thoughts after 3 years [2008-2011]
Jul 14 2011, 11:28 AM EDT | Post edited: Jul 14 2011, 11:28 AM EDT
"Since I found that explaining after having my one, try to ignore it and read that scene in this other way: the head came through because, as Cameron wanted them (...us) to notice, the chip was active. This better explains why the T-1000 in T2 can go through, why Weaver can go through AND why Cameron's body doesn't came through in BtR. In this way all make more sense


"
Then by that logic wouldn't that then mean anything could come through. Whether organic or not they'd just have to be active or 'living', which would still contradict one of the fundamental T-verse imposed time travel rules.

"(except one thing: why do the LMTs arrive naked, if their "clothes" are part of them?)"

This begs a more interesting question - however they work they appear to be able to synthesise living flesh to a degree that the TDE will pass them through, while at the same time emulate common clothing materials to a similar level of detail. If they arrive without clothing have they just lost an amount of their own body mass in the process? Perhaps Weaver reverted to being naked the moment before the jump?
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termi-ninja-tor
termi-ninja-tor
10. RE: Tscc Ep 01 Pilot my thoughts after 3 years [2008-2011]
Jul 14 2011, 11:58 AM EDT | Post edited: Jul 14 2011, 11:58 AM EDT
""(except one thing: why do the LMTs arrive naked, if their "clothes" are part of them?)"

This begs a more interesting question - however they work they appear to be able to synthesise living flesh to a degree that the TDE will pass them through, while at the same time emulate common clothing materials to a similar level of detail. If they arrive without clothing have they just lost an amount of their own body mass in the process? Perhaps Weaver reverted to being naked the moment before the jump?"
This makes sense. That must be it.
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Oz-n-Ks
Oz-n-Ks
11. RE: Tscc Ep 01 Pilot my thoughts after 3 years [2008-2011]
Jul 17 2011, 8:53 PM EDT | Post edited: Jul 17 2011, 8:53 PM EDT
One the things that always bothered me in the Pilot, was where did the power come from, that was needed for the TDE to form the bubble, let alone make it jump?

If it took a small amount of power just to form the bubble ,I could see 120 to 220V that would be available in a commercial building. But the power requirement to make it jump to another time, would take the power production of a nuclear power plant,or some other high energy component . Such as a nuclear power Pack!

Maybe the gun that Cameron built was not a weapon, but more of an energy siphon and Cromartie was always meant to be the major power source for the jump. That would explain Cameron's answer to Sarah's question about the gun........Is it Nuclear?......Not Really! Also when Sarah pulled the trigger on the gun, she was inside the "Forming but Weak" bubble ,the energy bolt was between the guns barrel and Cromartie,s chest and the barrel was at the inside edge of the bubble.

Cromartie's head detached the same instant the bolt hit him and his/its forward momentum carried the head on into the bubble.( the most important part of a Terminator is not the combat chassis , but the chip!)

If this is the case then you have to ask the questions.

Why did Cameron build the gun first, instead of starting up the TDE first?

How did she know Cromartie was coming and later outside the vault door, warning John to keep clear of it?

Why was all of Cromartie's shots aimed high (one hitting the strong box just above Cameron's head, others hitting the lights) You would think that after knocking out the plate in the door he would peek through to see where his targets were and adjust his elevation accordingly.

How did Cromartie know to be close to the banks location, arriving only a little after the SWAT Team.......Just Terminator luck?....or was it planned?
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termi-ninja-tor
termi-ninja-tor
12. RE: Tscc Ep 01 Pilot my thoughts after 3 years [2008-2011]
Jul 17 2011, 9:10 PM EDT | Post edited: Jul 17 2011, 9:15 PM EDT
"1) Why did Cameron build the gun first, instead of starting up the TDE first?

2) How did she know Cromartie was coming and later outside the vault door, warning John to keep clear of it?

3) Why was all of Cromartie's shots aimed high (one hitting the strong box just above Cameron's head, others hitting the lights) You would think that after knocking out the plate in the door he would peek through to see where his targets were and adjust his elevation accordingly.

4) How did Cromartie know to be close to the banks location, arriving only a little after the SWAT Team.......Just Terminator luck?....or was it planned?"
1) The easy answer is that it would be good standard procedure, to have a defensive armament in case your enemy showed up before you could escape. And it was correct in this instance. (Correct sequencing, just like putting on your own oxygen mask before helping children in an aircraft decompression emergency.)

2) Perhaps this is another example of proper standard operating procedure. Or, maybe she heard some sign he was approaching.

3) He was a bad shot. He missed John at the high school. He missed the Connors at the police station in Mexico. He was always a bad shot. Perhaps he was trained on recoilless plasma firearms or not trained at all.

4) Cromartie would be trying to find the Connors. He might assume they would be in the Los Angeles area because he would be aware that his Skynet got its start in the Los Angeles area, just as Cameron knew this, and there would be a good chance they might go after this Skynet predecessor.
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Oz-n-Ks
Oz-n-Ks
13. RE: Tscc Ep 01 Pilot my thoughts after 3 years [2008-2011]
Jul 18 2011, 1:35 AM EDT | Post edited: Jul 18 2011, 1:35 AM EDT
1. Yes that would be the easy answer! But is it the right answer? It could also be possible that the Connors were being herded to the bank vault, by Cameron either working with, or using Cromartie as threat incentive, to get the Connors to do want her primary mission really was.... Make the Time Jump!....Cameron never did say what her primary mission was!



2. Maybe Cameron is like Star in T-4 and can sense the the close proximity of a Skynet machine. In T-4 it is explained that the machines can communicate, both with each other and Skynet by short wave radio. Cameron might have been able to pick up any signals, that Cromartie "Could Have" inadvertently or purposely sent out ,if her RX was programed to receive on Cromartie's frequencies.

3. Bad shot, or missing on purpose? He managed to hit Cameron at least 5 times, had a good clear shot when John ran across the room and didn't take it. His sighting crosshair was off to Johns right when he took the shot ,as John dived out the window. When John ran along the length of the bus, he had to have been able to see John's feet, in order to shoot out the windows above him. Why not go for a foot shot and bring him down then come around the bus and finish him off.

Also why? (on my Pilot DVD) at 20:33 to 20:33.38 did Cromartie shut down his Terminate protocall , Targeting program and then a complete system shut down, when he had John cornered between the cars ,before Cameron hit him with the truck?

What I heard was!...Cromartie was getting his Hyper Alloy Combat Chassis lubed ,when Skynet was passing out the marksmanship programs....;) Everyone knows that a robot can't resist a good lube job! :D (C3PO)

You remember when Cameron gave that little smile, when Sarah told her that they were going to LA, instead of Mexico?...Maybe that was a "COOL" my job just got easier,time to make a phone/Tx call smile.
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MetalShifter
MetalShifter
14. RE: Tscc Ep 01 Pilot my thoughts after 3 years [2008-2011]
Jul 18 2011, 1:44 AM EDT | Post edited: Jul 18 2011, 1:44 AM EDT
" 1. Yes that would be the easy answer! But is it the right answer? It could also be possible that the Connors were being herded to the bank vault, by Cameron either working with, or using Cromartie as threat incentive, to get the Connors to do want her primary mission really was.... Make the Time Jump!....Cameron never did say what her primary mission was!
"
I have to admit this is an outstandig good point. A backup for this point of view is also that Cameron electrocuted Cromartie but missed to extracted the chip during the 120 seconds before reboot.

The argument that she wants to go after the Connors fails, because without a threat it would have been easy to find the Conners again, without taking the risk of failing her missing. If her mission was to do the time jump, then it is totally clear, why she didn't kill Cromartie.
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MetalShifter
MetalShifter
15. RE: Tscc Ep 01 Pilot my thoughts after 3 years [2008-2011]
Jul 18 2011, 1:53 AM EDT | Post edited: Jul 18 2011, 1:53 AM EDT
"3. Bad shot, or missing on purpose? He managed to hit Cameron at least 5 times, had a good clear shot when John ran across the room and didn't take it. His sighting crosshair was off to Johns right when he took the shot ,as John dived out the window. When John ran along the length of the bus, he had to have been able to see John's feet, in order to shoot out the windows above him. Why not go for a foot shot and bring him down then come around the bus and finish him off.

Also why? (on my Pilot DVD) at 20:33 to 20:33.38 did Cromartie shut down his Terminate protocall , Targeting program and then a complete system shut down, when he had John cornered between the cars ,before Cameron hit him with the truck?

What I heard was!...Cromartie was getting his Hyper Alloy Combat Chassis lubed ,when Skynet was passing out the marksmanship programs....;) Everyone knows that a robot can't resist a good lube job! :D (C3PO)
"
Well, well, well ;-)
If Cromartie were "the" Terminator, Skynet wouldn't need to send a lot of other machines through time, because the easiest job would be to kill off John Connor instead of sending a lot of machines back to do a lot of other strange tasks. ;-) But anyway the pilot would have been much shorter and the show would have been doomed from the beginning if Cromartie were not such a failure. ;-)

In the finale the circle closes, why it was not this important if Cromartie succeded or not, because: NO John Connor in the future and mainkind still alive! ;-)
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Oz-n-Ks
Oz-n-Ks
16. RE: Tscc Ep 01 Pilot my thoughts after 3 years [2008-2011]
Jul 18 2011, 3:47 AM EDT | Post edited: Jul 18 2011, 3:47 AM EDT
"Well, well, well ;-)
If Cromartie were "the" Terminator, Skynet wouldn't need to send a lot of other machines through time, because the easiest job would be to kill off John Connor instead of sending a lot of machines back to do a lot of other strange tasks. ;-) But anyway the pilot would have been much shorter and the show would have been doomed from the beginning if Cromartie were not such a failure. ;-)

In the finale the circle closes, why it was not this important if Cromartie succeded or not, because: NO John Connor in the future and mainkind still alive! ;-)"
Yes! I realize that TSCC would have been very short ,if Cromartie had succeeded in killing John in the first EP....;) I am also sure that Skynet has realized this by now, since every attempt at killing John in the past has failed, because John is alive and well in the future.

What I'm saying is that Sarah has a pattern of being a real knot head sometimes and wants to do things her way. More than likely future John knows this and knows that the only way to get his knot headed mother to do, what his future self wants, is to confront her and his past self with a threat. ie: Cromartie. Then present her and him with a saviour ie:Cameron.

The Connors were the sheep, Cameron the sheep herder and Cromartie the sheep dog. The sheep herder and the sheep dog work together, in order to get what the herder wants the sheep to do. In this case the sheep get to jump through time!
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Oz-n-Ks
Oz-n-Ks
17. RE: Tscc Ep 01 Pilot my thoughts after 3 years [2008-2011]
Jul 18 2011, 4:42 AM EDT | Post edited: Jul 18 2011, 5:08 AM EDT
"I have to admit this is an outstandig good point. A backup for this point of view is also that Cameron electrocuted Cromartie but missed to extracted the chip during the 120 seconds before reboot.

The argument that she wants to go after the Connors fails, because without a threat it would have been easy to find the Conners again, without taking the risk of failing her missing. If her mission was to do the time jump, then it is totally clear, why she didn't kill Cromartie."
Thanks MetalShifter!

I understand why Josh wanted to film the Pilot at 64 frames per second, instead of 32 frames per second. He crammed a bunch of information, in that one second between 20:33 and 20:34 (DVD) This is what made me come to believe that Cameron and Cromartie were working together...On The Great Connor Cattle Drive...LOL



Why remove the chip, if you needed Cromartie to be at the bank vault, as a source of major power for the TDE. Let him get there under his own power to do his job! That's if he was not only being used as a threat, but also to be used as the main power source for the bubble to jump!
I'll also point out that an M-16 with a 30 round magazine pointed and firing into the back of a fleeing car! Other than Cameron ,the Connors should have looked like ripe melons! Out of 30 rounds Cromartie only get one hit and it's just a flesh wound?...Maybe its an "Oops" or a bit more threat incentive?

I remember Cromartie having to make some adjustments during his repairs, but was it before or after the encounter at the Dyson's home?

It took Cameron 73 days to locate the Connors the first time ,if they went even deeper to ground, it could have taken her even longer to reacquire them a second time. Skynet could do a lot of mischief in that time, both in the future and in the past!
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termi-ninja-tor
termi-ninja-tor
18. RE: Tscc Ep 01 Pilot my thoughts after 3 years [2008-2011]
Jul 18 2011, 1:20 PM EDT | Post edited: Jul 18 2011, 1:20 PM EDT
"The Connors were the sheep, Cameron the sheep herder and Cromartie the sheep dog. The sheep herder and the sheep dog work together, in order to get what the herder wants the sheep to do. In this case the sheep get to jump through time! "
So if you believe Cameron and Cromartie were working together to herd the Connors, who was the mastermind for this -- future John or Skynet or . . . ? And why?
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t5000
t5000
19. RE: Tscc Ep 01 Pilot my thoughts after 3 years [2008-2011]
Jul 19 2011, 2:23 PM EDT | Post edited: Jul 19 2011, 2:23 PM EDT
"So if you believe Cameron and Cromartie were working together to herd the Connors, who was the mastermind for this -- future John or Skynet or . . . ? And why?"
it would be john, he could have been the one to send cromartie back, and given him a faulty aiming program?
although the head going thru was a "oops"
you could say that is also why cromartie never killed ellison, and also that john knew cromarite's body was needed to create JH. ellison was needed to educate JH, and also deliver the body to weaver.

@ shmacky about the parts I picked to say were bad, I was saying those were the parts that turned the nielsen crowd away from the show, as after viewing the pilot, almost 1/2 of them didnt come back for ep 2 the next night.
so what parts of the pilot would you or others say caused the nielsen viewers to not come back for ep 2??
they didnt like somethingI also think that lena looked nothing like linda hamiltonalso turned them off, and then no arnold type(body builder) terminator.
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