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belezeebub
belezeebub
A weighty problem
Apr 11 2008, 2:48 PM EDT | Post edited: Apr 11 2008, 2:48 PM EDT
Okay I talked about this in a post a few months ago and I finely have the answer. Taking facts from the only source I have, I re-watched all the terminator movies and in the making of T3 in the bathroom scenes they finely answered my question a T3 Movie Terminator weighs 2000 pounds, which fills in a lot of the issues I have had with the science behind the TV and Movie when two terminators fight buildings shake vans rocks back and forth and walls get destroyed, so Sarah could not have possibility have lifted Cameron into that chair when the trapped safe caused her to shut down and reboot. Most of the cars they drive around in wouldn’t carry her weight which goes to prove Cameron is an advanced proto-type, she is almost as strong as a terminator but with a lot less mass, I would guess Cameron weighs on the order of 500 pounds. I know it’s a TV show and I know the laws of Physics don’t apply to TV and Movies but it’s a pet peeve of mine when holly weird shifts gears mid stream on physics issues. I still want to know why Skynet would design a terminator that can not only eat but one that would look like a teen girl, I have a feeling if SCC gets a next season we will find out Skynet didn’t build her but John did, future john already knows the outcome because to him it has already happened, he is just filling in the blanks by sending back the right people and equipment at the right times. (Think Big John is a freak and he built himself a toy to play with then with the time portal he sent it to him self as a present) Cameron isn’t there to help john stop Skynet because that can’t happen she is there is give john the training and knowledge to become the leader he needs to be.

IMHO

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Cuckoo4CocoaPuffs
Cuckoo4CocoaPuffs
1. RE: A weighty problem
Apr 11 2008, 3:03 PM EDT | Post edited: Apr 11 2008, 3:03 PM EDT
Her mass and weight have got to be almost the same as that of the young woman she is emulating, maybe just slightly more. She would not be able to move as gracefully as she did when ballet dancing if she was that structurally "massive."

However, that doesn't stop something like a chimp from being more powerful (strength to weight) than a normal human (if an angry chimp got a hold of you.. you're in big trouble!). It's the way the muscles are designed... much more leverage. Plus, the Terminator flesh muscle structure is augmented with pistons that must have tremendous strength to weight ratios. Do you find this valuable?    
Krazykaleb
Krazykaleb
2. RE: A weighty problem
Apr 11 2008, 3:17 PM EDT | Post edited: Apr 11 2008, 3:17 PM EDT
"Her mass and weight have got to be almost the same as that of the young woman she is emulating, maybe just slightly more. She would not be able to move as gracefully as she did when ballet dancing if she was that structurally "massive."

However, that doesn't stop something like a chimp from being more powerful (strength to weight) than a normal human (if an angry chimp got a hold of you.. you're in big trouble!). It's the way the muscles are designed... much more leverage. Plus, the Terminator flesh muscle structure is augmented with pistons that must have tremendous strength to weight ratios. "
Yes I agree with you idea. Also with regard to Cameron being built by John is not likely. Um, Because Derek Reese recognized her as a bad Terminator. So I'm sure their are more than one Cameron out there. You never know because in one of the interview with Summer Glau she said that she could go bad. Or that another terminator that looks exactly like her might appear. Just like there were two T800s. One that was Bad and one that was good in the second movie..

But with the idea of her being heavy. I think that she my be a hybrid of two different types of metal. Thus makeing her light in weight but dense enough to withstand heat and battle. So she might be part coltan and somthing else. Sort of like how Gold has a little bit of ore to keep it hard. That kind of idea. Do you find this valuable?    
Krazykaleb
Krazykaleb
3. RE: A weighty problem
Apr 11 2008, 3:20 PM EDT | Post edited: Apr 11 2008, 3:20 PM EDT
"Yes I agree with you idea. Also with regard to Cameron being built by John is not likely. Um, Because Derek Reese recognized her as a bad Terminator. So I'm sure their are more than one Cameron out there. You never know because in one of the interview with Summer Glau she said that she could go bad. Or that another terminator that looks exactly like her might appear. Just like there were two T800s. One that was Bad and one that was good in the second movie..

But with the idea of her being heavy. I think that she my be a hybrid of two different types of metal. Thus makeing her light in weight but dense enough to withstand heat and battle. So she might be part coltan and somthing else. Sort of like how Gold has a little bit of ore to keep it hard. That kind of idea."
Because other terminator like Vick the T-888. He was a whole lot heavyer than Cameron. This is because you can see that she used his weight against him when they were fighting in the police truck. She is different remember. She said that early in the series. Do you find this valuable?    
AverageJo
AverageJo
4. RE: A weighty problem
Apr 11 2008, 3:45 PM EDT | Post edited: Apr 11 2008, 3:45 PM EDT
You''ve highlighted a real problem: the movie and TV series need to adhere to some sort of internal consistency; there were wild inconsisencies in T3. Recall that in T1 Arnie's terminator was knocked down by close-range shotgun blasts; in T3 he was so massive that he cracked the floor when knocked down.

The TSCC producers need to keep an eye on this. IIRC, some movies/TV series have a position called "consistency coodinator" (or something like that) to ensure that these types of problems don't balloon out of control. 1  out of 1 found this valuable. Do you?    
HK103
HK103
5. RE: A weighty problem
Apr 11 2008, 3:58 PM EDT | Post edited: Apr 11 2008, 3:58 PM EDT
Cameron doesn't weight 500 pounds. I've seen an author from the show say on the terminatorfiles.com forum that their Terminators are heavier than humans but don't weight some absurd amount. Do you find this valuable?    
belezeebub
belezeebub
6. RE: A weighty problem
Apr 11 2008, 4:05 PM EDT | Post edited: Apr 11 2008, 4:05 PM EDT
"Her mass and weight have got to be almost the same as that of the young woman she is emulating, maybe just slightly more. She would not be able to move as gracefully as she did when ballet dancing if she was that structurally "massive."

However, that doesn't stop something like a chimp from being more powerful (strength to weight) than a normal human (if an angry chimp got a hold of you.. you're in big trouble!). It's the way the muscles are designed... much more leverage. Plus, the Terminator flesh muscle structure is augmented with pistons that must have tremendous strength to weight ratios. "
Just like a jackhammer rocks up and down when being used if she didn't have enough weight she would rock back from the force of her own blows, think of it this way, if you built a 5’8 tall upright post placed it on a base of 1 sqft (a guess at the surface area of her feet) put 105 pounds on the base (once again a guess at her weight) and placed a air ram strong enough to punch through a cinder block wall the device would be forced backwards from its own blows, every action has and equal and opposite reaction. Do you find this valuable?    
belezeebub
belezeebub
7. RE: A weighty problem
Apr 11 2008, 4:09 PM EDT | Post edited: Apr 11 2008, 4:09 PM EDT
"Yes I agree with you idea. Also with regard to Cameron being built by John is not likely. Um, Because Derek Reese recognized her as a bad Terminator. "
Derek shouted out Metal he didn't know good or bad just somehow desided she was a terminator in the next scence he is told she is working for them as are many other T-XXX units Do you find this valuable?    
Krazykaleb
Krazykaleb
8. RE: A weighty problem
Apr 11 2008, 4:14 PM EDT | Post edited: Apr 11 2008, 4:14 PM EDT
"Derek shouted out Metal he didn't know good or bad just somehow desided she was a terminator in the next scence he is told she is working for them as are many other T-XXX units"
Yes but you can't be absolutely positive about who made her until we find out. There way the show show it. IT could go either way. Do you find this valuable?    
belezeebub
belezeebub
9. RE: A weighty problem
Apr 11 2008, 4:47 PM EDT | Post edited: Apr 11 2008, 4:47 PM EDT
"Yes but you can't be absolutely positive about who made her until we find out. There way the show show it. IT could go either way."
It’s the whole reason for this site to figure stuff out, it’s what makes me good at what I do (as long as it isn't spelling or grammar) I analyze everything is drives my wife nuts if there is a scene in a movie where a watch tan line is visible but they are in ancient Rome I’ll see it, if someone copies a gig of data to a floppy disk I’ll point it out.

In T2 the terminator is standing on one foot with a guy hanging from his arm and he is not tipping over that assumes he is very heavy, in T1 he is asking for weapons that don’t exist if he was a computer he would know what would be around in the year he is sent back too, and who could forget the magic self fixing windshield in the truck, in the chase down the LA Aqua duct, last but not lease T2 he can not self terminate but in T3 he pulls out his own power supply (remember he had two one got damaged he toss that one out the window) the second one he shoved into the bad terminators mouth which looked worried a emotion I didn’t know machines had, the Bad terminator panicked and looked scared and the good terminator sacrificed him self to save John.
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Cuckoo4CocoaPuffs
Cuckoo4CocoaPuffs
10. RE: A weighty problem
Apr 11 2008, 4:52 PM EDT | Post edited: Apr 11 2008, 4:52 PM EDT
And you have to deal with the fantasy quotient. Cameron could be light weight (Sarah did lift her with a little difficulty), but dense, and have her own "laws of physics" since, heck, there ARE no Terminators in real life! =)

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belezeebub
belezeebub
11. RE: A weighty problem
Apr 11 2008, 5:03 PM EDT | Post edited: Apr 11 2008, 5:03 PM EDT
"And you have to deal with the fantasy quotient. Cameron could be light weight (Sarah did lift her with a little difficulty), but dense, and have her own "laws of physics" since, heck, there ARE no Terminators in real life! =)

"
I am just trying to figure out how it could be possible with the technologies we have for all we know Cameron could weight a metric ton but have a anti gravity device in her left butt cheek that makes her weight 108 pounds.

In the scope of the technoligies we have and the ones they show I am just trying to purpose possible ways it could work, nothing more.
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HK103
HK103
12. RE: A weighty problem
Apr 11 2008, 5:10 PM EDT | Post edited: Apr 11 2008, 5:10 PM EDT
"Just like a jackhammer rocks up and down when being used if she didn't have enough weight she would rock back from the force of her own blows, think of it this way, if you built a 5’8 tall upright post placed it on a base of 1 sqft (a guess at the surface area of her feet) put 105 pounds on the base (once again a guess at her weight) and placed a air ram strong enough to punch through a cinder block wall the device would be forced backwards from its own blows, every action has and equal and opposite reaction."
Not necessarily true. Many people can throw punches that carry more force than their weight. They aren't thrown back because the impact is absorbed through their muscles and with good footing even into the ground. Do you find this valuable?    
intrepid
intrepid
13. RE: A weighty problem
Apr 11 2008, 5:14 PM EDT | Post edited: Apr 11 2008, 5:14 PM EDT
I doubt Cameron was built by john because if you think about it that would require a vast amount of resources and specialised equipment and a “clean” room. all the things a scrappy bunch of Luke Skywalker types would be hard pressed to find. If he had that sort of ability his first order of business would be advanced weapons such as the Terminator energy weapons and since they seem to be in short supply its doubtful he has the means to do it. Besides Cameron has already told us where she was built in the episode “Heavy Metal”.
I totally agree and have mentioned before the idea that a list of specifications need to be posted in the writers room of the show so inconsistency’s in what a terminator can do don’t happen or accumulate.
It has been suggested throughout the show that terminators weigh more than their human equivalent but then we see them interact with human designed items which suggests that isn’t the case, such as when Vick gets into bed with his wife, I’m sure she would have gotten suspicious if she rolled over in bed to look at Vick and only saw a Vick shaped indentation in the mattress that would be very hard to explain and funny :) lol Do you find this valuable?    
T-1976
T-1976
14. RE: A weighty problem
Apr 11 2008, 6:07 PM EDT | Post edited: Apr 11 2008, 6:07 PM EDT
Perhaps she has the endoskeleton made out of the newest type of Coltan.....strong and lightweight

Remember, she is different ;) Do you find this valuable?    
C.Isaac
C.Isaac
15. RE: A weighty problem
Apr 11 2008, 6:41 PM EDT | Post edited: Apr 11 2008, 6:41 PM EDT
From what I've seen in the series so far, I'm guessing the average male/bulky terminator (T-888 like Vick or Cromartie) weigh in the neighborhood of 350 pounds. A wooding dining table can hold one up. They don't crush beds they sit or lay down on.

Cameron probably weighs less. Between 250-300 pounds. She can sit on a wooden stool in John's room. She can sit in metal/aluminum desks at high school without crushing them. She can be dragged by Sarah and could be pushed out the window of the resistance safehouse.

The Turk (a staff writer's alias) on the terminatorfiles.com mentioned that they are meant to be 'hefty' but not incredibly heavy, otherwise they couldn't blend in. The weight shown by Arnie's T-850 in T3 is a bit silly and the movie is no longer canon for the series anyways. Do you find this valuable?    

KrelleK
16. RE: A weighty problem
May 7 2008, 1:55 PM EDT | Post edited: May 7 2008, 1:55 PM EDT
"I am just trying to figure out how it could be possible with the technologies we have for all we know Cameron could weight a metric ton but have a anti gravity device in her left butt cheek that makes her weight 108 pounds.

In the scope of the technoligies we have and the ones they show I am just trying to purpose possible ways it could work, nothing more.
"
Well not that I would like to talk bad about Cam´s(Summer) weight but i think if she does weight a metric tone, a anti gravity device would eighter sit at the end of her probably Coltan made Spine, in between her actually quite beautyfull popocheeks, or device in both, or i think there would be problem with the balance, just my thoughts KrelleK Do you find this valuable?    
sad_panda
sad_panda
17. RE: A weighty problem
Feb 17 2009, 11:37 PM EST | Post edited: Feb 17 2009, 11:37 PM EST
Either Cameron isn't as heavy as you think or John is really strong:

http://terminatorwiki.fox.com/album/72576/TSCC+Behind+Scenes+ScreenCaps/photo/3373033/Behind+the+scenes
http://terminatorwiki.fox.com/album/72576/TSCC+Behind+Scenes+ScreenCaps/photo/3373034/Behind+the+scenes 1  out of 1 found this valuable. Do you?    

jhowell928s
18. RE: A weighty problem
Feb 18 2009, 5:04 AM EST | Post edited: Feb 18 2009, 5:04 AM EST
I'm not really sure how they figure Arnold would have weighed a ton in T3. That's just ridiculous. Floors would crack under his feet. He wouldn't be able to sit in a car or operate a motorcycle.

In the show, Cameron is made from coltan. In real life, coltan is used for making things like electronics capacitors. So it's use in the show is purely fictional in that they simply borrowed the name to make it sound like some futuristic metal alloy. So it can be whatever it wants. I would think lightweight would be a characteristic. Do you find this valuable?    
Gusar
Gusar
19. RE: A weighty problem
Feb 18 2009, 5:19 AM EST | Post edited: Feb 18 2009, 5:19 AM EST
"Either Cameron isn't as heavy as you think or John is really strong:

http://terminatorwiki.fox.com/album/72576/TSCC+Behind+Scenes+ScreenCaps/photo/3373033/Behind+the+scenes
http://terminatorwiki.fox.com/album/72576/TSCC+Behind+Scenes+ScreenCaps/photo/3373034/Behind+the+scenes"
That's a behind the scenes photo, it has nothing to do with Cameron. That said, here's what the writers have to say about Terminator weight: http://bbs.stardestroyer.net/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=127803 -> short summary: they weight up to 20% more than a human of the same size.

@jhowell928s: It's possible to use coltan as alloy. From wikipedia about tantalum (in TSCC, coltan is processed tantalum niobium):
"Tantalum is also used to produce a variety of alloys that have high melting points, are strong and have good ductility. Alloyed with other metals, it is also used in making carbide tools for metalworking equipment and in the production of superalloys for jet engine components, chemical process equipment, nuclear reactors, and missile parts."

While making a whole endoskeleton might be a stretch in today's time, we're talking here about machines from 2027. Do you find this valuable?    
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